Liedewij Loorbach ‘We do not work for someone who is raking in money. Everyone works for the mission'

What is your big dream?
An economy that creates value for everyone, instead of the extractive economy we are currently in. One that squeezes as much as possible out of the earth, or out of employees. Or one in which people on the other side of the world are forced to work for very little pay. I would also very much like to move away from shareholder capitalism, where as much value as possible is extracted from a company in order to generate enormous wealth for a small, select group. Yes, that is something I truly dream of.

Do you remember when that dream first emerged?
That drive for justice has always been there. That feeling that the world should simply be organised in a fairer way. At a certain point, I read Doughnut Economics by Kate Raworth, which explains how our current economy operates far beyond planetary boundaries. If we continue within this capitalist system, large parts of the earth will become uninhabitable and everything will eventually collapse. We all need to move towards a different kind of economy altogether.

In which situation did you really show courage?
When we decided to go fully organic. It was 2019, and financially things were going very badly at Sprinklr. Our investors came from the more conventional ornamental horticulture sector and were putting pressure on us to soften our focus on sustainability. But we wanted to send a very clear message. We preferred to operate in a niche rather than try to appeal to everyone. Communicating that was quite difficult. It took a long time before people understood that not every plant is organic to begin with. You need certification for that and you have to comply with all kinds of European regulations. It is also a very challenging market. There were few growers, and consumers did not realise that every plant, except organic ones, contains pesticides. So demand was low as well.

My partner Suzanne van Straaten and I looked at each other and asked ourselves: what truly makes us happy? In e-commerce it is often a race to the bottom. You become the biggest by offering your product at the lowest possible price. That is not what we wanted to spend our lives on. So we went looking for investors who genuinely believed in our story about biodiversity.

When did the tipping point come?
During the coronavirus pandemic. Everyone was at home, with a lot of time on their hands, and everyone wanted to start gardening. On top of that, everything had to be ordered online because shops were closed, and we were fully set up for that. The public debate also focused more than ever on health, pesticides, and the loss of biodiversity.

Have you ever taken part in a demonstration?
So many times, it never seems to stop. About twelve years ago, I joined a demonstration against the American multinational Monsanto, because of their pesticides and genetically modified crops. I have also been active with Extinction Rebellion and have demonstrated against the genocide of the Palestinian people.

What does that bring you?
Demonstrating helps me deal with feelings of powerlessness, anger, and sadness. I believe in democratic values such as freedom, equality, solidarity, human rights, fair distribution, and equal opportunities. All of those values are eroding at an alarming pace. It is comforting to come together with people who actively stand up for them. I can sometimes feel despondent and wonder what the point of it all really is. But every now and then you hear or read inspiring stories about individuals and movements that really can make a difference. And then I go out and demonstrate again.

What is the best piece of leadership advice you have ever received?
A good friend once said something to me when we were at the Lowlands festival together. If you want to do something as a group, sometimes it simply means that you have to wait for each other. I still think about that from time to time. At the time, she was literally talking about me needing to be patient when I wanted to go to the next performance and the rest of the group simply was not ready yet. Suzanne also sometimes tells me that I think too quickly and forget to bring others along. I am already at the conclusion, while others still need a bit of time. If you want an organism to move, you cannot always set the pace on your own.

How have you changed over the past ten years?
I have become much calmer. Less irritable. The first few years at Sprinklr were extremely stressful. I worked alongside it because we were not earning anything yet. We were still building the company. That financial stress really made me grumpy. I vividly remember someone in the warehouse dropping a pot. The purchase price was about six euros. It really did not matter. Yet I completely lost my temper. I said it was absolutely not acceptable and that people needed to be more careful. Later, I stopped and thought: what is this actually about? People should be able to work in an environment of trust, where it is okay to break a pot now and then without someone cracking the whip. Now that the company is doing better, I notice that my mood has improved as well.

What is absolutely non-negotiable for you?
Selling plants treated with poison. I have never really been tempted, but at times it has been difficult. For example, there are very few farmers who grow organic bulbs. The largest one spent years looking for a successor. Fortunately, one has now been found. Otherwise, we would have faced a real dilemma. Do we stop selling organic bulbs altogether, or do we settle for a slightly less sustainable alternative? As far as I am concerned, we would never do that. That would dilute our brand.

Can all plants be grown without pesticides?
Yes, but probably not on a large, commercial scale. Some plants are very vulnerable. Growers invest a great deal of time in breeding plants and flowers. Let us say there are around 50,000 varieties for consumers to choose from. I would say: focus on the plants that can more easily be grown without pesticides and build your offer around those. I believe customers would be perfectly happy with a choice of 25,000 varieties as well.

If you could introduce a new law, what would it stipulate?
That steward ownership is legally recognised as a form of private limited company. At the moment, it is legally very complex. Sprinklr is steward owned, which means that the shares are held by a foundation and we are all employees. Under steward ownership, control and profit rights are separated. Our investors have effectively become lenders, and we will probably be able to repay them next year, when we have been in existence for ten years. Once those loans are repaid, the company is fully ours. Suzanne and I donated our shares and receive a very normal salary. In hindsight, I sometimes think that perhaps we could have allowed ourselves a little more, given how long we worked extremely hard for little or no pay. Now that I am looking for a new home, I occasionally think an extra hundred thousand euros would have been nice. But the question “what is enough?” has always been our guiding principle. And I have more than enough.

Why did you choose this model?
Because we want to contribute to a new economy that is about creating broad-based prosperity. Steward ownership simply makes sense. I get irritated by the start-up world, where entrepreneurs are portrayed as heroes who supposedly deserve obscene compensation for their so-called brilliant ideas and courage. While you know how many people have worked just as hard, and how many people have given you opportunities along the way. We felt that very strongly ourselves. Our success was also shaped by people who offered us affordable workspace, by friends who came to help pack orders in the evenings. It is so much more meaningful to do something for a community. We all feel it at Sprinklr. We do not work for someone who is raking in money. Everyone works for the mission.

Text: Vera Spaans